SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Michael Laine
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SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by Michael Laine » Wed Sep 02, 2009 4:44 pm

Greetings PacificNG

Are any of the paint schemes for the proposed PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0's correct or close (with proper decal lettering) to the SPC? Thanks - Mike Laine

Randy Hees
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by Randy Hees » Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:33 am

Locos 2 & 3 were delivered in Lake and Gold Style 1, so the version similar to Eureka and Sonoma, but without lettering would be correct for those two. 4, 5, & 6 were delivered in Green, style 49, so the olive green loco, with style one striping on the loco and a simplified tender (Craig is working on it) would be correct. 7 & 8 were the same paint but had larger drivers...

All the locomotives were repainted within a few (3?) years... probably originally into something similar to Green, style 49, but by 1893 into SP style black, so for those you could use the black loco with russian iron jacket.

Randy Hees
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dsp&p_fan
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by dsp&p_fan » Mon Sep 28, 2009 9:51 am

How about NCNG #1 or #3? Green or Red?

I've suddenly acquired the resources to get one...and I'm on the fence as to red or green.

David Fletcher
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by David Fletcher » Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:10 pm

Hi DSP Fan,
With regard to the NCNG locos, I can confirm the following, with the Baldwin spec sheets in front of me:

NCNG #1 - Lake & Gold, style 1....she only just made the date for Lake colour in 1875..had she been built a month or two earlier she would have been wine style 1. The spec has Wine & Gold noted, crossed out, and changed to Lake! Same for the little mogul NCNG #2.
Essentially, that means for the MMI models, you'll be looking for the Lake Style 1 version, just like Sonoma, only with 'Nevada County' on the tender. We did a live steam version of NCNG #1 for Accucraft, as a genertic 4-4-0. I can also confirm from the spec sheet that as built she carried an iron pilot, also like Sonoma, not the wood pilot.
One thing that is different with NCNG #1 - the cab was infact Painted Ash. What that means is, the cab was also painted Lake colour, not polished Walnut. Try and tell a model co to do that and keep the sales?! I tried..still the Walnut look you have to understand is just way cool.

NCNG #3 was a couple of years later at a time when Style 1 had sorta been modernised to Style 49, and Olive Green (that very very dark green) had replaced Lake. NCNG #3 by the spec sheet was OLive Green and Gold, style 49, same as the MMI green 49 models. Also with Green painted cab. Tender side should simply have 'Nevada County' painted on it.

Therefore the MMI offerings also cover the NCNG 4-4-0s well.

More data - the NCNG 4-4-0s were actually technically slightly smaller than the MMI version, both being 8-16-C class, not the 8-18-C, but visually they were almost identical, we're talking slightly smaller cylinders and maybe an inch less in the boiler diameter. The NCNG 4-4-0s #1 and #1 were both 8-16-C Drawing 3 locos.

Finally, as folks keep reading these types of questions and time and again find the Style 1 or 49 appropiate for their personal roads - Baldwin, like so many loco builders of this age, delivered locos in their standard paint styles, which evolve over time. In the mid 1870s, Style 1 was their style of choice for anything passenger related (although used on all types of locos too!), and by the late 1870s, they had toned down the gilding and decoration on the tender, creating style 49. If you buy a Ferarri today, you'll most likely recieve it in their popular paint colours..ie that special Red...infact you expect to, and want that! So to was it with Baldwin. BUT, the original paint usually only lasted on the road 3-5 years, so repainting did come later.

Hope this help,
David.

dsp&p_fan
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by dsp&p_fan » Fri Oct 02, 2009 6:05 am

David,
That is exactly what I was looking for! The question is know whether I want a stock model (Sonoma), get some custom decals (NCNG #1), or a local engine (Cincinnati Northern #1). I'm leaning towards either Sonoma or NCNG #1...perhaps I'll get the unlettered version and leave the decision for the future.

Thanks,
Michael

John Coker
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by John Coker » Sat Oct 03, 2009 8:45 pm

David, some questions....

1. If the PSC's new die-cast 4-4-0s are 8-18-C, what was the class of NCNG #7 (Ex-SPng #4) Was it a bigger 4-4-0 ?

2. I have an old PSC Kodama brass 4-4-0. is it an 8-18-C? It is numbered NCNG #7.

3. Does PSC plan any models lettered for NCNG or any modernized versions?
Thanks, John.

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Andrew Brandon
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by Andrew Brandon » Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:41 am

John,

Sadly neither the PSC or MMI model is a suitable stand-in for NCNG #7. The Carson and Colorado 4-4-0s were all 8-22Cs, a much larger machine than the 8-18C and are noticeably longer than the 8-18C. Even the NCNG's earlier 4-4-0s were 8-16Cs and were a bit smaller than the 8-18C.

If you aren't a rivet counter and will settle for something close enough, I believe #DC1231-1 represents the same paint style used on the C&C locomotives without lettering.

http://psc1.virtualfocus.com/MMI%20DRG% ... -On30.html
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John Coker
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8-22-C

Post by John Coker » Mon Oct 05, 2009 5:14 pm

I thought the C&C engines were way larger than other n.g. 4-4-0s. I have a Sn3 Railmaster kit I plan to make as NCNG #1. I recommended a scale drawing years ago to John Agnew of Railmaster so I assume it is an 8-16-C or an 8--18-C. BTW is there a website or anywhere I can see all the PSC die-cast versions?

dsp&p_fan
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by dsp&p_fan » Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:41 am

It has been reported on the On3 yahoo group that they have been canceled. Caboose Hobbies now has them as being brass pre-orders.

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Andrew Brandon
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Re: SPC and PSC D&RG Class 42 4-4-0

Post by Andrew Brandon » Thu Oct 08, 2009 4:50 pm

I am interested in seeing how this pans out, primarily due to other developments in the On3/On30 world. It seems to me that a common, standard Baldwin product should have no problem selling. However as we've seen in the past the market has been inundated with "silly" 4-4-0 products from Bachmann. How is it a company like Bachmann has no trouble selling 2 4-4-0s that were hardly common beyond their representative prototypes and the roads they served, yet MMI has trouble rolling out a model of a locomotive common to roads all over the Americas.

While I know my modeling tastes are not indicative of the collective On3/On30 crowd, I personally took a look at the tiny inside frame 4-4-0 and immediately realized that it was essentially the mechanism from the HO 4-4-0 and that the model is suitable for about 4(?) locomotives that ever truly existed. Then we have the later Baldwin design Outside Frame 4-4-0, a machine so "out there" I made a joke 5-6 years ago to my roommate at the time: "This should be Bachmann's next locomotive!". I am lead to believe that this locomotive represents a single class of locomotive that went into service in Brazil a handful of which still survive.

While the Bachmann offerings have been interesting to say the least, a number of us have been let down by Bachmann's decision to release those models rather than release their 1:20.3 4-4-0 and 2-6-0 in On30. It is obvious that Bachmann has drawings for these and has already done CAD work on them. To someone who was a supporter of Bachmann for quite sometime I am slowly losing faith in their offerings. The upcoming 2-6-6-2 does give me hope despite still being an export locomotive. I can understand how models of export locomotives can broaden the consumer base, what I fail to understand is how continually offering export models and odd prototypes will help anyone but the arm chair modeler just wanting to play choo choos rather than offer them something far more likely for even their fictitious railroad to own.

As for MMI, I hold hope that they wont let us 500 people who reserved the 8-18C down. For those of us that devoted a lot of our time and effort to helping the project along, providing information and building up outside support to say that the model is most certainly "canceled" is a slap in the face. We know the Brass/Die Cast avenue was being pursued previously and I will not speculate on what the project holds in store for us in the coming months. This project has had its ups and downs for the past few years, before I am willing to say the die cast is "dead" I will wait for more official announcements. Even to that end I am willing to accept a hybrid, make the frame out of brass, die cast/plastic the rest ala Bachmann and get them out there.
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